Debate on bill on Wednesday, 15 October 2025, in the House of Lords, led by Baroness Sherlock and Baroness Anderson of Stoke-on-Trent. The answering member was Baroness Finn.

Public Authorities (Fraud, Error and Recovery) Bill

Lords report stage first day. Amendment 2 agreed to on division (200 to 194). Amendments 6 to 15 and 18 agreed to. Amendment 21 disagreed to on division (139 to 186). Amendments 23 and 24 agreed to.

Secondary information

Type: Parliamentary proceeding
Reference: 849 cc283-334
Session: 2024-26
Department: Department for Work and Pensions; Cabinet Office
Legislative stage: Report stage
Procedure: New clauses; Government defeats
Chamber / Committee: House of Lords chamber
Related items: Public Authorities (Fraud, Error and Recovery) Bill 2024-26. As amended in Grand Committee
Wednesday, 25 June 2025
Bills
House of Lords; Deposited Paper DEP2025-0699
Friday, 17 October 2025
Deposited papers
House of Lords
Proceeding contributions: Baroness Kramer | 849 c283 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Baroness Kramer
1: Clause 1, page 1, line 13, at end insert—
“(e) crea...; Baroness Kramer | 849 cc283-5 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I have tabled Amendments 1 and 20 in this group to raise again the issue of whistleblow...; Baroness Finn | 849 cc285-6 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I begin by thanking both Ministers opposite, and noble Lords from across the House, for...; Baroness Anderson of Stoke-on-Trent | 849 cc287-8 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, so we begin Report. I thank all noble Lords for their genuinely constructive engagement...; Baroness Kramer | 849 c288 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, the Minister has described some real momentum. As I say, we would always want more; whe...; Baroness Finn | 849 c288 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Baroness Finn
2: Clause 2, page 2, leave out line 10 and insert—
“whet...; Baroness Finn | 849 cc288-290 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I began by thanking the noble Baronesses opposite for their constructive engagement wit...; Lord Vaux of Harrowden | 849 c289 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I speak very briefly in support of Amendment 2. Before I start, I would like to echo th...; Baroness Fox of Buckley | 849 cc289-291 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I find myself in a difficult position: I am not usually one to want to give more power ...; Lord Palmer of Childs Hill | 849 c291 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, our principle generally is that the lowest level of government should make those decisi...; Baroness Anderson of Stoke-on-Trent | 849 cc291-2 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, fraud against the public sector takes money away from vital public services, enriches t...; Baroness Finn | 849 cc292-3 (Link to this contribution)
I thank the Minister for her incredibly persuasive arguments. We are clear that this is an unacce...; Baroness Finn | 849 c293 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Baroness Finn
3: Clause 3, page 3, line 9, at end insert—
“(4A) Where ...; Baroness Finn | 849 cc293-7 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I will speak to Amendments 3 and 4, tabled in my name and that of my noble friend Lord ...; Lord Vaux of Harrowden | 849 c297 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I rise briefly to add my support for Amendment 3, which would require any information n...; Baroness Fox of Buckley | 849 cc297-8 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, throughout Committee, concerns were raised about the amount of information-gathering po...; Lord Palmer of Childs Hill | 849 c298 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, we are in a world of information-sharing and information-gathering, and this is where t...; Baroness Anderson of Stoke-on-Trent | 849 cc298-9 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I appreciate the noble Baroness, Lady Finn, bringing forward these amendments again. I ...; Baroness Finn | 849 c299 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I am grateful to the Minister for her response, to the noble Lord, Lord Palmer, for his...; Baroness Finn | 849 c299 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Baroness Finn
5: Clause 7, page 5, line 22, at end insert—
“(5) Within...; Baroness Finn | 849 cc300-1 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, this amendment, tabled in my name and that of my noble friend Lord Younger of Leckie, s...; Baroness Fox of Buckley | 849 c301 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, after Committee this was one area of the Bill that I literally had nightmares about. I ...; Lord Palmer of Childs Hill | 849 c301 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, clearly, it would be best if something such as who these investigators are was in the B...; Baroness Anderson of Stoke-on-Trent | 849 cc301-2 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, it is essential that any individual authorised to use the powers enshrined in the Polic...; Baroness Finn | 849 cc302-3 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, we will not seek to divide the House on this amendment. I am sorry to disappoint the no...; Baroness Anderson of Stoke-on-Trent | 849 c303 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Baroness Anderson of Stoke-on-Trent
6: Clause 9, page 7, leave out lines 32 ...; Baroness Anderson of Stoke-on-Trent | 849 c303 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I was on my honeymoon last week, which is why our amendments were tabled in the name of...; Baroness Finn | 849 c303 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, we understand that these amendments are technical in nature, designed to ensure that th...; Baroness Anderson of Stoke-on-Trent | 849 c304 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, my honeymoon was fabulous.
I am grateful for the support of the House on these co...; Baroness Sherlock | 849 c304 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Baroness Sherlock
7: Clause 9, page 7, leave out lines 38 and 39
Membe...; Baroness Sherlock | 849 c304 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Baroness Sherlock
8: Clause 19, page 12, line 25, at beginning insert “Subje...; Baroness Sherlock | 849 cc304-6 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I cannot help thinking that if one of us was in Santorini and the other one was here ta...; Baroness Kramer | 849 cc305-7 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, obviously we are pleased to see these amendments. We want to look much more closely to ...; Lord Davies of Brixton | 849 c307 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I expressed considerable concern about this part of the Bill in Committee. I have studi...; Baroness Finn | 849 cc307-8 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, the amendments in this group all relate to the duties placed on banks and other financi...; Baroness Sherlock | 849 cc309-310 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I am grateful to the noble Baroness, Lady Finn, for that constructive response, and to ...; Baroness Sherlock | 849 c310 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Baroness Sherlock
9: Clause 19, page 12, line 32, at end insert—
“(9A)...; Baroness Sherlock | 849 c310 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Baroness Sherlock
10: Clause 26, page 16, line 14, leave out from second “no...; Baroness Sherlock | 849 cc310-1 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Baroness Sherlock
11: Clause 32, page 19, line 31, at end insert—
“(3)...; Baroness Sherlock | 849 c311 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Baroness Sherlock
12: Clause 37, page 22, leave out line 17
Member’s e...; Baroness Finn | 849 c311 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Baroness Finn
16: Clause 38, page 23, line 28, at end insert—
“(6A) Th...; Baroness Finn | 849 cc311-3 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, the amendments in this group focus on one central theme: ensuring proper scrutiny, tran...; Lord Davies of Brixton | 849 c313 (Link to this contribution)
I have already taken the opportunity to reiterate the concerns I have expressed about parts of th...; Lord Vaux of Harrowden | 849 cc313-4 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I am generally supportive of all the amendments in this group, but particularly Amendme...; Lord Palmer of Childs Hill | 849 c314 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, there are five of these amendments. Amendment 16
“would ensure that the outcome o...; Baroness Anderson of Stoke-on-Trent | 849 cc314-6 (Link to this contribution)
I thank the noble Baroness, Lady Finn, for raising the important issues around annual reporting a...; Baroness Finn | 849 cc316-7 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I thank the Minister for her remarks. I also thank the noble Lords, Lord Davies of Brix...; Baroness Sherlock | 849 c317 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Baroness Sherlock
18: Clause 44, page 26, line 30, at end insert—
“(3)...; Baroness Finn | 849 cc317-8 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Baroness Finn
21: After Clause 64, insert the following new Clause—
“F...; Baroness Finn | 849 cc318-320 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, this amendment, tabled in my name and that of my noble friend Lord Younger of Leckie, s...; Baroness Fox of Buckley | 849 c319 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, one reason why I support the intention of the Bill is that I have become concerned that...; Lord Palmer of Childs Hill | 849 c319 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I found it difficult to believe that this was being required of us today. Amendment 21 ...; Baroness Anderson of Stoke-on-Trent | 849 cc321-2 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, the noble Baroness, Lady Finn, is entirely right that public authorities responsible fo...; Lord Gove | 849 c322 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I listened with the close interest to the Minister’s response, which it seems to me can...; Baroness Anderson of Stoke-on-Trent | 849 c323 (Link to this contribution)
I have a huge amount of time and respect for the noble Lord, which is why I am smiling. He knows ...; Baroness Finn | 849 cc323-4 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I thank the Minister for her remarks and the careful consideration she has given this i...; Baroness Anderson of Stoke-on-Trent | 849 c324 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Baroness Anderson of Stoke-on-Trent
23: Clause 66, page 35, line 29, leave o...; Baroness Anderson of Stoke-on-Trent | 849 c327 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I now turn to government Amendments 23, 24, 68 and 69, regarding the disclosure of info...; Lord Vaux of Harrowden | 849 c327 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, we have a lot of discussions in this House about the difference between “may” and “must...; Baroness Finn | 849 cc328-9 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, we on these Benches warmly welcome these amendments in the name of the noble Baroness, ...; Baroness Anderson of Stoke-on-Trent | 849 cc329-330 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I am grateful for the contributions of noble Lords to this group. I will respond specif...; Baroness Sherlock | 849 c330 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Baroness Sherlock
24: Clause 66, page 35, line 30, after “person,” insert “w...; Baroness Finn | 849 c330 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Baroness Finn
25: After Clause 66, insert the following new Clause—
“I...; Baroness Finn | 849 cc330-2 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, the main focus of my remarks in this group will be on Amendment 35. This amendment, in ...; Baroness Anderson of Stoke-on-Trent | 849 cc331-3 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, it could almost be that we are back in Committee. It is the “Baroness Finn, Baroness An...; Baroness Finn | 849 cc333-4 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, as this is the final group today, I will be brief. I thank the Minister. I was going to...
Notes: Scottish legislative consent granted, Welsh legislative consent sought.
Subjects: Disclosure of information Criminal investigation Debts Costs Bank services Banks Deductions Department for Work and Pensions Fraud Enforcement Financial institutions Overpayments Powers Public sector Public Sector Fraud Authority Social security benefits Repayments Reviews Risk management Information sharing
Legislation: Public Authorities (Fraud, Error and Recovery) Bill 2024-26
Link: View this Parliamentary proceeding on hansard.parliament.uk

Public Authorities (Fraud, Error and Recovery) Bill

Secondary information

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