Debate on bill on Tuesday, 26 February 2019, in the House of Lords, led by Baroness Williams of Trafford and Baroness Barran.

Offensive Weapons Bill

Lords report stage first day. Government amendments agreed to. Government new clause (Knife crime prevention orders made otherwise than on conviction) agreed to on division (145 votes to 84). Further Government new clauses agreed to. Other amendments debated and withdrawn or not moved.

Secondary information

Type: Parliamentary proceeding
Reference: 796 cc155-224
Session: 2017-19
Department: Home Office
Legislative stage: Report stage
Procedure: New clauses
Chamber / Committee: House of Lords chamber
Related items: Offensive Weapons Bill 2017-19. As amended in committee.
Tuesday, 12 February 2019
Bills
House of Lords; Deposited Paper DEP2019-0297
Tuesday, 5 March 2019
Deposited papers
House of Lords
Proceeding contributions: Baroness Hamwee | 796 c155 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Baroness Hamwee
1: Clause 1, page 1, line 9, leave out first “all”
Mem...; Baroness Hamwee | 796 cc155-6 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, Amendment 1 is in my name and that of my noble friend Lord Paddick, as are all the othe...; Baroness Williams of Trafford | 796 cc156-7 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, as the noble Baroness explained, these amendments relate to the level of burden of proo...; Baroness Hamwee | 796 c157 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, it is certainly a burden in the sense of the weight of it rather than the balance of it...; Baroness Hamwee | 796 c157 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Baroness Hamwee
3: Clause 1, page 1, line 10, at end insert—
“( ) The ...; Baroness Hamwee | 796 c158 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, the noble Lord, Lord Lucas, is unable to be here but has asked me to move this amendmen...; Lord Kennedy of Southwark | 796 c158 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, Amendment 3 in the name of the noble Lord, Lord Lucas, and moved by the noble Baroness,...; Earl of Erroll | 796 c158 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I think that a bit of certainty here is essential. One of the problems that exist elsew...; Baroness Williams of Trafford | 796 cc158-9 (Link to this contribution)
I thank noble Lords for their comments. I agree that, as the noble Lord, Lord Kennedy, and the no...; Baroness Hamwee | 796 c159 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I am indeed. I beg leave to withdraw the amendment.; Lord Paddick | 796 c159 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Lord Paddick
4: Clause 1, page 1, line 19, after second “if” insert “they us...; Lord Paddick | 796 c159 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, on behalf of the noble Lord, Lord Lucas, and at his request, I move Amendment 4 and sha...; Lord Kennedy of Southwark | 796 c159 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, Amendments 4 and 69, moved by the noble Lord, Lord Paddick, on behalf of the noble Lord...; Earl of Erroll | 796 cc160-1 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I want to say a couple of things about this as I have been involved in this area for so...; Baroness Barran | 796 cc161-2 (Link to this contribution)
I am grateful to the noble Lord, Lord Paddick, for moving this amendment in the absence of my nob...; Earl of Erroll | 796 c162 (Link to this contribution)
Before the noble Baroness sits down, I would like to correct her: there is a British standard. As...; Baroness Barran | 796 c162 (Link to this contribution)
I will certainly do that. I reassure the noble Lord that I did go to dpatechgateway.co.uk, so my ...; Lord Paddick | 796 c163 (Link to this contribution)
I thank the Minister for her explanation, although I am a little confused. My understanding is th...; Baroness Hamwee | 796 c163 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Baroness Hamwee
5: Clause 1, page 2, line 15, leave out from “Wales,” to end...; Baroness Hamwee | 796 cc163-5 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, in moving Amendment 5 in my name and that of my noble friend Lord Paddick, I shall spea...; Lord Hogan-Howe | 796 cc165-6 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I am going to say some contradictory things on this amendment—I have spent a career doi...; Lord Elton | 796 c166 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I too want to say something controversial, which I think the noble Lord, Lord Hogan-How...; Baroness Meacher | 796 c166 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I support these amendments. The one thing we know about short sentences is that people ...; Lord Ramsbotham | 796 c167 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I too support the amendments. I was at the speech given by the Secretary of State for J...; Earl of Listowel | 796 cc167-8 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I also support these amendments, particularly Amendment 32, which would remove Clause 8...; Lord Kennedy of Southwark | 796 cc168-9 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I am happy to support the noble Lord’s amendments today. The noble Baroness wants to st...; Baroness Williams of Trafford | 796 cc169-170 (Link to this contribution)
I thank noble Lords who have spoken to these amendments, which are about the use of short custodi...; Lord Elton | 796 c170 (Link to this contribution)
Can my noble friend assist me? I ask forgiveness for my ignorance but as I read subsection (7), i...; Baroness Williams of Trafford | 796 c170 (Link to this contribution)
I do not know whether my noble friend was in Committee, but when the amendment on having just a c...; Lord Elton | 796 c171 (Link to this contribution)
If I may trouble my noble friend once more, as I read it, they are prohibited from applying a sen...; Baroness Williams of Trafford | 796 c171 (Link to this contribution)
My noble friend is absolutely right about the maximum sentence, but alights on an important aspec...; Lord Kennedy of Southwark | 796 c171 (Link to this contribution)
The Minister mentions an interesting point, about the company being prosecuted, and then talked a...; Baroness Williams of Trafford | 796 c171 (Link to this contribution)
In precedence for these sorts of cases, it is quite often the company that is prosecuted, with a ...; Lord Kennedy of Southwark | 796 c171 (Link to this contribution)
When we had the debate before, I think it was suggested by one of the Minister’s noble friends th...; Baroness Williams of Trafford | 796 cc172-3 (Link to this contribution)
The prosecution may well fall on a director, because the director is seen to have fallen short in...; Baroness Hamwee | 796 c173 (Link to this contribution)
I am grateful to all noble Lords who have contributed. The noble Lord, Lord Hogan-Howe, may not e...; Baroness Barran | 796 c173 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Baroness Barran
8: Clause 1, page 2, line 29, at beginning insert “Subject t...; Baroness Barran | 796 c173 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, in Committee I undertook to consider an amendment tabled by the noble Viscount, Lord Cr...; Viscount Craigavon | 796 c174 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, as I moved the original amendment in Committee, I will intervene first. I am grateful t...; Duke of Montrose | 796 cc174-5 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I will probe whether the amendment fully does what the Government intend on one or two ...; Viscount Goschen | 796 c175 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I spoke in support of the noble Viscount, Lord Craigavon, in Committee. I thank the Gov...; Baroness Barran | 796 c175 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I thank my noble friend the Duke of Montrose for his detailed questions about the use o...; Duke of Montrose | 796 c175 (Link to this contribution)
I am sure that my noble friend the Minister has looked into this in more up-to-date detail than I...; Baroness Barran | 796 c175 (Link to this contribution)
I think this is above my battery expertise. I was advised that even open vent batteries have caps...; Baroness Barran | 796 c175 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Baroness Barran
9: Clause 1, page 2, line 36, at end insert—
“(12A) Be...; Baroness Barran | 796 c176 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, Schedule 1 contains a list of corrosive products for the purposes of the offences in Cl...; Lord Paddick | 796 c176 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I am grateful to the Minister for these amendments. One of the main things that irked p...; Baroness Barran | 796 c176 (Link to this contribution)
I apologise to the noble Baroness for my oversight.; Baroness Hamwee | 796 c176 (Link to this contribution)
I am not irked—I rarely get irked.; Baroness Barran | 796 c176 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Baroness Barran
10: Clause 1, page 2, line 37, leave out “subsection (12)” a...; Lord Paddick | 796 c176 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Lord Paddick
12: Schedule 1, page 45, leave out line 12
Member’s expla...; Lord Paddick | 796 c176 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, in moving this amendment I will speak also to Amendment 13. The only purpose of revisit...; Baroness Barran | 796 c177 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, as the noble Lord, Lord Paddick, pointed out, these amendments return to the debate we ...; Lord Paddick | 796 c177 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, the Minister has completely failed to address the point that I just raised—but in any e...; Lord Paddick | 796 c178 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Lord Paddick
14: Clause 3, page 4, line 13, at end insert “unless the delive...; Lord Paddick | 796 cc178-9 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, in moving Amendment 14 I will speak also to the other amendments in this group.
A...; Lord Kennedy of Southwark | 796 c179 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, these amendments, in the name of the noble Lord, Lord Paddick, seek to allow the delive...; Baroness Williams of Trafford | 796 cc179-180 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I am grateful to the noble Lord, Lord Paddick, for explaining the rationale of these am...; Duke of Montrose | 796 c180 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I have a series of amendments later on to do with the delivery of bladed articles to re...; Baroness Williams of Trafford | 796 cc180-1 (Link to this contribution)
Turning to my noble friend’s question, if your home is also your registered business address, the...; Lord Paddick | 796 c181 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I am grateful to the noble Lord, Lord Kennedy, for his qualified support for these amen...; Lord Kennedy of Southwark | 796 c181 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Lord Kennedy of Southwark
27: After Clause 5, insert the following Clause—; Lord Kennedy of Southwark | 796 cc182-3 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I raised this issue at Second Reading and in Grand Committee. I am grateful for the sup...; Lord Paddick | 796 c183 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, as I said in Committee, we support the amendment. Until last Friday, we were prepared t...; Viscount Goschen | 796 cc183-4 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I listened with interest as the noble Lord, Lord Kennedy, introduced his amendment. I a...; Baroness Neville-Rolfe | 796 c184 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, as some noble Lords know, my background is in retail, and I have experience of managing...; Baroness Williams of Trafford | 796 cc184-5 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I thank noble Lords for speaking to this amendment. I am particularly grateful to the n...; Lord Kennedy of Southwark | 796 c185 (Link to this contribution)
I thank the noble Baroness for giving way. I am pleased that we are going to have a call for evid...; Baroness Williams of Trafford | 796 c186 (Link to this contribution)
I totally understand the noble Lord’s point. He reminds me at every opportunity and I think that ...; Baroness Neville-Rolfe | 796 c186 (Link to this contribution)
I wonder whether my noble friend could comment on who sits on the National Retail Crime Steering ...; Baroness Williams of Trafford | 796 c187 (Link to this contribution)
Representatives of USDAW are part of the steering group along with staff from large retail organi...; Lord Hogan-Howe | 796 c187 (Link to this contribution)
I am minded to support the amendment, because the case is a good one for shop workers. I just won...; Baroness Williams of Trafford | 796 c187 (Link to this contribution)
The noble Lord makes a good point about aggravated offences—and of course, that can be explored t...; Lord Kennedy of Southwark | 796 cc187-8 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I thank everyone who has spoken in the debate. There was a lot of support around the Ho...; Baroness Barran | 796 c188 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Baroness Barran
33: Clause 9, page 10, line 42, at end insert—
“(5) In...; Baroness Barran | 796 c189 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, as we have previously debated, the Bill includes provision for mandatory minimum senten...; Baroness Williams of Trafford | 796 cc189-190 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Baroness Williams of Trafford
35: After Clause 13, insert the following new ...; Baroness Williams of Trafford | 796 cc190-3 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, the government amendments in this group introduce knife crime prevention orders. Noble ...; Lord Paddick | 796 cc193-6 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I said a lot about knife crime prevention orders in Committee. Tonight I am going to fo...; Lord Hogan-Howe | 796 cc196-8 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I also spoke in Committee. I cannot agree with the noble Lord, Lord Paddick, as he is a...; Baroness Meacher | 796 cc198-9 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I rise to respond to the government amendments in this group, as well as Amendments 55 ...; Baroness Hamwee | 796 cc199-200 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I am speaking partly as a member of the Joint Committee on Human Rights. I am not going...; Lord Ponsonby of Shulbrede | 796 cc200-1 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I rise to speak against the Government’s proposals. I remind the House that I sit as a ...; Lord Ramsbotham | 796 c201 (Link to this contribution)
I rise to oppose the KCPO proposal, as I did in Grand Committee. I shall not repeat all the argum...; Earl of Listowel | 796 cc201-2 (Link to this contribution)
I express my deep concerns about what the Government are proposing. I also felt that the Minister...; Lord Kennedy of Southwark | 796 cc202-3 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, knife crime prevention orders are an attempt by the Government to deal with the horror ...; Baroness Williams of Trafford | 796 cc203-6 (Link to this contribution)
I thank all noble Lords for their contributions. I particularly thank the noble Lord, Lord Kenned...; Earl of Listowel | 796 c206 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, will the Minister ensure that in any pilots, an assessment will be made of the impact o...; Baroness Williams of Trafford | 796 c206 (Link to this contribution)
The noble Earl is right to point out that children in care are the most vulnerable people in all ...; Baroness Williams of Trafford | 796 cc206-219 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Baroness Williams of Trafford
36: After Clause 13, insert the following new ...; Baroness Williams of Trafford | 796 cc219-220 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Baroness Williams of Trafford
52: After Clause 13, insert the following new ...; Baroness Williams of Trafford | 796 cc220-1 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Baroness Williams of Trafford
61: After Clause 13, insert the following new ...; Lord Paddick | 796 c221 (Link to this contribution)
Moved by
Lord Paddick
66: Clause 15, page 14, leave out lines 36 and 37
Member’...; Lord Paddick | 796 c221 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I am moving this amendment on behalf of the noble Lord, Lord Lucas, and at his request....; Baroness Barran | 796 cc221-2 (Link to this contribution)
I am grateful to the noble Lord, Lord Paddick, for explaining the amendment on behalf of my noble...; Duke of Montrose | 796 c222 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, perhaps my noble friend can clarify on the record to what extent an article is regarded...; Baroness Barran | 796 c223 (Link to this contribution)
I will write to my noble friend with an accurate answer on that. I am confident that there is a t...; Lord Paddick | 796 c223 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I am grateful to the Minister for her explanation. The noble Lord, Lord Lucas, wanted t...
Subjects: Crimes against the person Age Delivery services EU countries Licensing Liability Exemptions Labelling Internet Knives Pilot schemes Offensive weapons Mobile phones Staff Proof of identity Parcels Prison sentences Rehabilitation Sales Young people Young offenders Shops Technology Batteries Community orders Brexit Corrosive substances Knife crime prevention orders
Legislation: Offensive Weapons Bill 2017-19
Link: View this Parliamentary proceeding on hansard.parliament.uk

Offensive Weapons Bill

Secondary information

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