My Lords, I agree with the previous two speakers on only one point: you either have an appointed House or an elected House. I am not trying to curry favour with people whose opinion is against an elected House. The principles are very important and cannot be ignored. The democratic...

My Lords, I agree with the previous two speakers on only one point: you either have an appointed House or an elected House. I am not trying to curry favour with people whose opinion is against an elected House. The principles are very important and cannot be ignored. The democratic...

That could be entirely representative of the country. I am not saying that this is the answer; I am saying that it should be investigated. I know that there is great scepticism about this, as can be heard, but the future of the House rests on accountability, and indeed legitimacy...

That could be entirely representative of the country. I am not saying that this is the answer; I am saying that it should be investigated. I know that there is great scepticism about this, as can be heard, but the future of the House rests on accountability, and indeed legitimacy...

My Lords, I thank the Minister in particular for the conclusion in the amendment about fair representation on the Assembly Commission. We put forward the amendment and there was a lot of support for it throughout Wales. The Conservative Party supported it, too. Common sense has very much come to...

My Lords, I thank the Minister in particular for the conclusion in the amendment about fair representation on the Assembly Commission. We put forward the amendment and there was a lot of support for it throughout Wales. The Conservative Party supported it, too. Common sense has very much come to...

My Lords, we too think that this is a very satisfactory outcome. The amendment is a combination of amendments originally tabled in Committee by both the Conservatives and the Liberal Democrats to allow for a wider choice in the name of the committee and we are pleased that the Government...

My Lords, we too think that this is a very satisfactory outcome. The amendment is a combination of amendments originally tabled in Committee by both the Conservatives and the Liberal Democrats to allow for a wider choice in the name of the committee and we are pleased that the Government...

My Lords, I believe that contained in Motion F is the recipe for some conflict in the future. Those of us who soldiered on, for example in the 1979 referendum on whether there should be a Welsh Assembly, can conceive of any kind of outcome that could occur. Although the...

My Lords, I believe that contained in Motion F is the recipe for some conflict in the future. Those of us who soldiered on, for example in the 1979 referendum on whether there should be a Welsh Assembly, can conceive of any kind of outcome that could occur. Although the...

My Lords, I apologise for not being here when the debate started, but it started 25 minutes early, which is very good. At this moment, I should be a steward in the Royal Welsh Show, taking around overseas judges to judge educational stands—20 in all—but government business managers have decided...

My Lords, I apologise for not being here when the debate started, but it started 25 minutes early, which is very good. At this moment, I should be a steward in the Royal Welsh Show, taking around overseas judges to judge educational stands—20 in all—but government business managers have decided...

moved Amendment No. 21:"Page 21, line 12, at end insert—" ““(   )   This section ceases to have effect on the day on which the Assembly Act provisions come into force.”” The noble Lord said: My Lords, we discussed this amendment with the group Cymru Yfory—Tomorrow’s Wales—which is concerned that the section,"““ceases to have effect on the...

moved Amendment No. 21:"Page 21, line 12, at end insert—" ““(   )   This section ceases to have effect on the day on which the Assembly Act provisions come into force.”” The noble Lord said: My Lords, we discussed this amendment with the group Cymru Yfory—Tomorrow’s Wales—which is concerned that the section,"““ceases to have effect on the...

moved Amendment No. 22:"Page 21, line 17, leave out ““Secretary of State”” and insert ““Assembly””" The noble Lord said: My Lords, this amendment comes from the same source. The Bill allows the Secretary of State the discretion to decide whether to consult the Assembly about Bills in the UK Government’s legislative programme. It seems...

moved Amendment No. 22:"Page 21, line 17, leave out ““Secretary of State”” and insert ““Assembly””" The noble Lord said: My Lords, this amendment comes from the same source. The Bill allows the Secretary of State the discretion to decide whether to consult the Assembly about Bills in the UK Government’s legislative programme. It seems...

My Lords, this is a very interesting amendment. Sometimes it is a good idea to extrapolate certain circumstances from amendments and the consequences thereof. It is interesting to note that the first two First Ministers in the Assembly have been Ministers of the Crown in this place. Had they, under...

My Lords, this is a very interesting amendment. Sometimes it is a good idea to extrapolate certain circumstances from amendments and the consequences thereof. It is interesting to note that the first two First Ministers in the Assembly have been Ministers of the Crown in this place. Had they, under...

My Lords, I have listened with interest to this debate and to what the Minister has said. We assume that, in this instance, we are referring specifically to the Secretary of State for Wales and his or her role in this situation. We will evaluate the Minister’s response. In the mean...

My Lords, I have listened with interest to this debate and to what the Minister has said. We assume that, in this instance, we are referring specifically to the Secretary of State for Wales and his or her role in this situation. We will evaluate the Minister’s response. In the mean...

My Lords, I thank noble Lords who have spoken. I thank the noble Lord, Lord Henley, for his support. As he said, there is very little difference between my amendment and his. We believe that it is necessary to do this. I understand what the Minister said, and there is no doubt that at...

My Lords, I thank noble Lords who have spoken. I thank the noble Lord, Lord Henley, for his support. As he said, there is very little difference between my amendment and his. We believe that it is necessary to do this. I understand what the Minister said, and there is no doubt that at...

My Lords, I note what the noble Lord, Lord Roberts of Conwy, and the Minister said. However, we are very familiar with the fact that the Assembly’s system of election was decided by primary legislation; indeed, we are going to alter it by primary legislation here in both Houses of Parliament. So...

My Lords, I note what the noble Lord, Lord Roberts of Conwy, and the Minister said. However, we are very familiar with the fact that the Assembly’s system of election was decided by primary legislation; indeed, we are going to alter it by primary legislation here in both Houses of Parliament. So...

moved Amendment No. 11:"Page 17, line 27, at end insert ““not belonging to the same political group””" The noble Lord said: My Lords, under this amendment we consider the Assembly commission. It is important to recognise why we have tabled this very simple amendment. Clause 27 on page 17 of the Bill sets out what the Assembly commission...

moved Amendment No. 11:"Page 17, line 27, at end insert ““not belonging to the same political group””" The noble Lord said: My Lords, under this amendment we consider the Assembly commission. It is important to recognise why we have tabled this very simple amendment. Clause 27 on page 17 of the Bill sets out what the Assembly commission...

moved Amendment No. 30:"Page 30, line 30, leave out ““twelve persons”” and insert ““20 per cent of the Assembly””" The noble Lord said: My Lords, Amendment No. 30 would ensure that no more than 20 per cent of the Assembly will hold ministerial office. That will allow sufficient Assembly Members to remain to scrutinise the Executive. The issue was...

moved Amendment No. 30:"Page 30, line 30, leave out ““twelve persons”” and insert ““20 per cent of the Assembly””" The noble Lord said: My Lords, Amendment No. 30 would ensure that no more than 20 per cent of the Assembly will hold ministerial office. That will allow sufficient Assembly Members to remain to scrutinise the Executive. The issue was...

My Lords, I did not refer to Amendment No. 28 in great detail, but the Minister is right to think that this would be a vote of no confidence in the First Minister. I am satisfied with the Minister’s response. The point seems to be covered in adjoining clauses. I can see that it is...

My Lords, I did not refer to Amendment No. 28 in great detail, but the Minister is right to think that this would be a vote of no confidence in the First Minister. I am satisfied with the Minister’s response. The point seems to be covered in adjoining clauses. I can see that it is...

moved Amendment No. 1:"Page 1, line 8, leave out subsection (2) and insert—" ““(   )   The Assembly is to consist of 80 members elected through the single transferable vote from multi-member constituencies.”” The noble Lord said: My Lords, Amendment No. 1 is grouped with Amendments Nos. 2, 3, 4, 7, 8 and 10. The purpose of the amendments is to install the single...

moved Amendment No. 1:"Page 1, line 8, leave out subsection (2) and insert—" ““(   )   The Assembly is to consist of 80 members elected through the single transferable vote from multi-member constituencies.”” The noble Lord said: My Lords, Amendment No. 1 is grouped with Amendments Nos. 2, 3, 4, 7, 8 and 10. The purpose of the amendments is to install the single...

My Lords, I, too, see a role for the Secretary of State for Wales, particularly with regard to what the noble Lord, Lord Roberts, just said. It was a very cogent point. The negotiation of the block grant for the Assembly is extremely important. The amendment recognises that in the transitional...

My Lords, I, too, see a role for the Secretary of State for Wales, particularly with regard to what the noble Lord, Lord Roberts, just said. It was a very cogent point. The negotiation of the block grant for the Assembly is extremely important. The amendment recognises that in the transitional...

My Lords, we, too, have tabled an amendment about the committee system and are critical of the d’Hondt method of allocation. Our amendment is somewhat longer than the Conservative amendment, but it amounts to a similar conclusion. It states:"““The members of any committee established by the Assembly under section 28(1)—""(a) shall...

My Lords, we, too, have tabled an amendment about the committee system and are critical of the d’Hondt method of allocation. Our amendment is somewhat longer than the Conservative amendment, but it amounts to a similar conclusion. It states:"““The members of any committee established by the Assembly under section 28(1)—""(a) shall...

My Lords, we have a great deal of sympathy with the amendment. It is important that the budgets are properly approved under the guidelines. The bodies listed in the amendment are important and should not be underfunded. I am sure that that would not happen but it is important to ensure...

My Lords, we have a great deal of sympathy with the amendment. It is important that the budgets are properly approved under the guidelines. The bodies listed in the amendment are important and should not be underfunded. I am sure that that would not happen but it is important to ensure...

My Lords, as the noble Baroness has said, the situation is analogous to a public accounts committee rather than an audit committee. I am aware that there may be problems from the point of view of the Assembly which the Minister may refer to, but he will have to seek to...

My Lords, as the noble Baroness has said, the situation is analogous to a public accounts committee rather than an audit committee. I am aware that there may be problems from the point of view of the Assembly which the Minister may refer to, but he will have to seek to...