The Minister is right; they are separate points. Of course, there is discretion, which remains right. The question is whether the set-up costs and the ongoing costs should be met at all from the public purse, or only from the two sources that she talked about. We need to have...

The Minister is right; they are separate points. Of course, there is discretion, which remains right. The question is whether the set-up costs and the ongoing costs should be met at all from the public purse, or only from the two sources that she talked about. We need to have...

The Ministers are saying that that is absolute rubbish, but it is not. In practice, many firms make their money through the easier route of conveyancing, which effectively allows them to do other things. We are having a separate debate about legal aid—not all such work is legal aided—but it...

The Ministers are saying that that is absolute rubbish, but it is not. In practice, many firms make their money through the easier route of conveyancing, which effectively allows them to do other things. We are having a separate debate about legal aid—not all such work is legal aided—but it...

I absolutely was not arguing that the consumer should bear the cost. I was arguing that not all the costs should necessarily fall on the companies or individuals who have been complained about, and that there might be a public interest in some of that cost being met publicly and...

I absolutely was not arguing that the consumer should bear the cost. I was arguing that not all the costs should necessarily fall on the companies or individuals who have been complained about, and that there might be a public interest in some of that cost being met publicly and...

I absolutely was not arguing that—

I absolutely was not arguing that—

I accept that. Indeed, my hon. Friends and I have always argued, in recent years, that there should be a Minister for Justice and that they should be in this place. We think that here is the right place for them to be and that they should be accountable to...

I accept that. Indeed, my hon. Friends and I have always argued, in recent years, that there should be a Minister for Justice and that they should be in this place. We think that here is the right place for them to be and that they should be accountable to...

That is an entirely separate debate, but certain costs are met—for example, those associated with certification officers—and other regulatory agencies are also part-funded by the taxpayer. So the answer is that we must have a reasonable outcome in the way in which the costs are met, and we need to...

That is an entirely separate debate, but certain costs are met—for example, those associated with certification officers—and other regulatory agencies are also part-funded by the taxpayer. So the answer is that we must have a reasonable outcome in the way in which the costs are met, and we need to...

The Government’s proposal, which is generally supported, is that there should be a legal services board, which will be a new organisation. It will employ people and those costs will have to be paid for. I am suggesting that we need to consider, in Committee, from where the whole costs...

The Government’s proposal, which is generally supported, is that there should be a legal services board, which will be a new organisation. It will employ people and those costs will have to be paid for. I am suggesting that we need to consider, in Committee, from where the whole costs...

The hon. Member for Stafford (Mr. Kidney) was right: this is not a Bill for which colleagues have come in numbers from all parts of the UK to ensure that the first day back after the half-term break is the most exciting parliamentary event in the Commons before the new...

The hon. Member for Stafford (Mr. Kidney) was right: this is not a Bill for which colleagues have come in numbers from all parts of the UK to ensure that the first day back after the half-term break is the most exciting parliamentary event in the Commons before the new...

There were not many. I accept that the majority were lawyers—I was not on the Committee—I was making the point that my hon. Friend the Member for Birmingham, Yardley, who comes from a non-legal background, was one of those who were not lawyers. That was important. I also pay tribute...

There were not many. I accept that the majority were lawyers—I was not on the Committee—I was making the point that my hon. Friend the Member for Birmingham, Yardley, who comes from a non-legal background, was one of those who were not lawyers. That was important. I also pay tribute...

I agree. The amendments all help to achieve a better list of principles in clause 1. The principles are of"““(a) protecting and promoting the public interest; (b) supporting the constitutional principle of the rule of law; (c) improving access to justice; (d) protecting and promoting the interests of consumers; (e)...

I agree. The amendments all help to achieve a better list of principles in clause 1. The principles are of"““(a) protecting and promoting the public interest; (b) supporting the constitutional principle of the rule of law; (c) improving access to justice; (d) protecting and promoting the interests of consumers; (e)...

First, yes, I speak on behalf of the Liberal Democrats. Secondly, my speech is not a eulogy to the legal professions. I have made it clear that the legal profession has a good reputation in this country, but it has also had its significant failures, and I started by saying...

First, yes, I speak on behalf of the Liberal Democrats. Secondly, my speech is not a eulogy to the legal professions. I have made it clear that the legal profession has a good reputation in this country, but it has also had its significant failures, and I started by saying...

In the debate about complaints—MPs have great experience of complaints against solicitors rather than against members of the Bar, although there are complaints against both—does the hon. Gentleman accept that the system has sometimes not worked very well for the professions, either? Significant numbers of solicitors have been unhappy about...

In the debate about complaints—MPs have great experience of complaints against solicitors rather than against members of the Bar, although there are complaints against both—does the hon. Gentleman accept that the system has sometimes not worked very well for the professions, either? Significant numbers of solicitors have been unhappy about...

I think that everyone in both Houses is grateful to the Committee that carried out the pre-legislative scrutiny—[Interruption.] No, they were not all lawyers. Having done that work, does the Minister accept that we should listen carefully to what it said, and that where its members supported Opposition amendments in...

I think that everyone in both Houses is grateful to the Committee that carried out the pre-legislative scrutiny—[Interruption.] No, they were not all lawyers. Having done that work, does the Minister accept that we should listen carefully to what it said, and that where its members supported Opposition amendments in...

The Minister helpfully indicated earlier how many of the pre-legislative scrutiny Committee’s recommendations had been accepted and how many had been rejected. I think that I have now calculated that she has addressed each amendment made by the House of Lords, and unless I am mistaken, she has indicated that...

The Minister helpfully indicated earlier how many of the pre-legislative scrutiny Committee’s recommendations had been accepted and how many had been rejected. I think that I have now calculated that she has addressed each amendment made by the House of Lords, and unless I am mistaken, she has indicated that...

I absolutely understand that point. We have debated how we do not want a health service in which people go to their general practitioner to get referred for an X-ray, for example, and are then shuttled between 19 different providers, even though they are getting one service. Of course, some...

I absolutely understand that point. We have debated how we do not want a health service in which people go to their general practitioner to get referred for an X-ray, for example, and are then shuttled between 19 different providers, even though they are getting one service. Of course, some...

I will not give way because otherwise colleagues will not have the opportunity to make their points—[Interruption.] I will not be tempted. There might even be a chance of an early finish if the hon. Member for North Durham (Mr. Jones) lets me finish shortly. There is an argument that...

I will not give way because otherwise colleagues will not have the opportunity to make their points—[Interruption.] I will not be tempted. There might even be a chance of an early finish if the hon. Member for North Durham (Mr. Jones) lets me finish shortly. There is an argument that...

As the Minister will have realised, this is controversial territory, to which the House of Lords devoted a great deal of time. I understood her to say that she did not want the professions to decide membership of the legal services board. The Lord Chief Justice, however, is not regarded...

As the Minister will have realised, this is controversial territory, to which the House of Lords devoted a great deal of time. I understood her to say that she did not want the professions to decide membership of the legal services board. The Lord Chief Justice, however, is not regarded...

I am not generalising at all. There are some extremely good local firms of solicitors that deal competently with the work with which they can deal and take on work that others might not because of their loyalty to a community and its residents. Such solicitors will often and perfectly...

I am not generalising at all. There are some extremely good local firms of solicitors that deal competently with the work with which they can deal and take on work that others might not because of their loyalty to a community and its residents. Such solicitors will often and perfectly...

It is impossible to generalise on this issue.

It is impossible to generalise on this issue.