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National Insurance Contributions Bill 2005-06

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National Insurance Contributions Bill 2005-06 (86)

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I will try to give an outline, but it may be helpful if I followed up and wrote to the noble Baroness on this. Code of practice 10 tells taxpayers about the different ways that information and advice can be provided. In particular, it gives the ways in which HMRC can help taxpayers by...

Member
Lord McKenzie of Luton (Labour)
Type
Proceeding contributions
Date
26 January 2006
Reference
677 c402GC
House
House of Lords

Like the noble Baroness, we accept through slightly gritted teeth the concept of retrospection in this Bill. I, too, would like some reassurance on how far forward, as it were, these provisions might operate and therefore how far back the retrospection might apply. Views change at the margin about what...

Member
Lord Newby (Liberal Democrat)
Type
Proceeding contributions
Date
26 January 2006
Reference
677 c377GC
House
House of Lords

I thank the Minister for that. I was not aware that in another place Ministers had explicitly said that they would not routinely seek to override that position. If that is the case, I accept the Minister’s assurance. I will read carefully what he said in Hansard. In the mean time I beg leave to...

Member
Baroness Noakes (Conservative)
Type
Proceeding contributions
Date
26 January 2006
Reference
677 c374GC
House
House of Lords

moved Amendment No. 10:"Page 5, line 11, after ““applies”” insert—" ““(a)   a Minister of the Crown must notify Parliament of his intention to lay such an instrument no later than the appropriate date; and (b)   ”” The noble Baroness said: In moving this amendment to Clause 1, I shall speak also to the similar amendment to Clause 2,...

Member
Baroness Noakes (Conservative)
Type
Proceeding contributions
Date
26 January 2006
Reference
677 c387-8GC
House
House of Lords

moved Amendment No. 11:"Page 5, line 12, after ““be”” insert—" ““(a)   published by the Treasury for the purposes of consultation with those persons who are or may be affected by it for a period of not less than three months; and (b)   ”” The noble Baroness said: I shall move Amendment No. 11. I had intended to table...

Member
Baroness Noakes (Conservative)
Type
Proceeding contributions
Date
26 January 2006
Reference
677 c389-90GC
House
House of Lords

I hope that I can help the noble Baroness with her inquiries into these matters. The purpose of Clause 3 is to introduce powers to enable the Treasury to make regulations on matters affecting the law that relate to class 1A national insurance contributions, in consequence of retrospective tax legislation which affects a person’s general...

Member
Lord McKenzie of Luton (Labour)
Type
Proceeding contributions
Date
26 January 2006
Reference
677 c391-2GC
House
House of Lords

What the noble Baroness seeks to achieve will happen in practice, but the amendment is unnecessary. All regulations made under the Bill will be published in draft. They will also be subject to a 12-week consultation prior to regulations being brought forward for approval by both Houses of Parliament. The Paymaster...

Member
Lord McKenzie of Luton (Labour)
Type
Proceeding contributions
Date
26 January 2006
Reference
677 c390GC
House
House of Lords

I thank the Minister for that. He explains the rule, as it has been explained in another place. We still find it difficult to see why it is necessary to do this—why it is fair to employees to let them off agreements that they have freely entered into. That seems to...

Member
Baroness Noakes (Conservative)
Type
Proceeding contributions
Date
26 January 2006
Reference
677 c394GC
House
House of Lords

The amendments are intended to limit the application of Clauses 5 and 6. The effect of that limitation would be that agreements and elections entered into before 2 December could continue to operate, and to allow the employer to pass any employers’ backdated national insurance liabilities on to the employee on payments made through an...

Member
Lord McKenzie of Luton (Labour)
Type
Proceeding contributions
Date
26 January 2006
Reference
677 c393-4GC
House
House of Lords

I thank the noble Baroness for moving the amendment and raising this issue. Before I deal with the specifics, I should not let pass the concluding remarks on our previous discussion about the difference between ““expedient”” and ““reasonable””, which might imply that the Treasury could act unreasonably in relation to the proposals. I stress...

Member
Lord McKenzie of Luton (Labour)
Type
Proceeding contributions
Date
26 January 2006
Reference
677 c372-3GC
House
House of Lords

I thank the noble Baroness and the noble Lord for their contributions to the debate. It is an interesting place to start. It is important to note that it is not simply that it must appear to the Treasury to be expedient before regulations can be made. In the case of...

Member
Lord McKenzie of Luton (Labour)
Type
Proceeding contributions
Date
26 January 2006
Reference
677 c369-70GC
House
House of Lords

I notify the Committee that I have received a letter from the Minister—I do not know whether the noble Baroness has received a copy, but no doubt she has—which deals with the point that I made at Second Reading. The answer appears to be that if the employee has left the company, the employer...

Member
Lord Newby (Liberal Democrat)
Type
Proceeding contributions
Date
26 January 2006
Reference
677 c384GC
House
House of Lords

moved Amendment No. 8:"Page 3, leave out lines 32 to 38." The noble Baroness said: In moving Amendment No. 8 to Clause 1, I speak also to the other amendments with which it is grouped, which would make similar provisions in relation to Clauses 2, 3 and 4. We are accustomed to regulation-making powers that are widely drawn but it is incumbent on...

Member
Baroness Noakes (Conservative)
Type
Proceeding contributions
Date
26 January 2006
Reference
677 c385GC
House
House of Lords

I do not know how much that would be at risk, because I do not know how good the disclosure regime will be. I notice that the Minister again did not provide examples of any new schemes that have emerged that need to be dealt with. I know that that there is a general...

Member
Baroness Noakes (Conservative)
Type
Proceeding contributions
Date
26 January 2006
Reference
677 c382-3GC
House
House of Lords

moved Amendment No. 7:"Page 3, line 20, at end insert—" ““(   )   any purpose relating to the payment or recoverability of additional primary contributions which become payable;”” The noble Baroness said: In moving the amendment I shall speak also to Amendment No. 18, which is identical, except that it applies to Northern Ireland. Amendment No. 7 would amend new...

Member
Baroness Noakes (Conservative)
Type
Proceeding contributions
Date
26 January 2006
Reference
677 c383-4GC
House
House of Lords

My noble friend Lord Skelmersdale and the noble Lord, Lord Newby, have more than adequately poured scorn on the idea that affirmative regulations are some kind of protection and that the parliamentary processes in the House of Commons on the Finance Bill are also a form of protection. I shall carefully note...

Member
Baroness Noakes (Conservative)
Type
Proceeding contributions
Date
26 January 2006
Reference
677 c381-2GC
House
House of Lords

I suspect, not often. That does not negate the process, does it? That always happens the year there is a majority government. I would have thought that it was routinely the case—I have not gone back over many Finance Bills—that legislation is changed and draft Bills are refined as matters are discussed. That...

Member
Lord McKenzie of Luton (Labour)
Type
Proceeding contributions
Date
26 January 2006
Reference
677 c381GC
House
House of Lords

As this may be my last appearance at the Dispatch Box this afternoon, I thank the noble Baroness, Lady Noakes, for her contributions. I thank, too, the noble Lord, Lord Newby, and, in his absence, the noble Lord, Lord Skelmersdale. We have had a constructive run through the measure and I am sure that we...

Member
Lord McKenzie of Luton (Labour)
Type
Proceeding contributions
Date
26 January 2006
Reference
677 c408GC
House
House of Lords

I cannot pretend that the Minister’s answer is a great surprise to me. I say to the noble Lord, Lord Newby, that I accept that two years is the wrong time period for finding out whether this provision is worth continuing with; I freely concede that. The issue comes back to the fact that the...

Member
Baroness Noakes (Conservative)
Type
Proceeding contributions
Date
26 January 2006
Reference
677 c408-10GC
House
House of Lords

Amendment No. 36 seeks to ensure that all regulations made under the national insurance disclosure provisions in the Bill will be subject to the affirmative resolution procedure. That is unnecessary. If Clause 7 is adopted, Parliament will already have taken a decision to extend the income tax disclosure rules to national insurance. It is...

Member
Lord McKenzie of Luton (Labour)
Type
Proceeding contributions
Date
26 January 2006
Reference
677 c398GC
House
House of Lords